New Mexicans for Science and Reason

The Aztec, NM UFO Scam

The Aztec UFO Reading Room

Fortean Times #181, March 2004: "Incident at Aztec"

J. P, Cahn's September 1952 masterpiece in TRUE Magazine, "The Flying Saucers and the Mysterious Little Men"

J. P, Cahn's 1956 followup in TRUE Magazine, "Flying Saucer Swindlers"

Robert Sheaffer's Debunker's Domain, "The Frank Scully 'Crashed UFO' Hoax (1950)":


New NMSR Page: "FBI Memo Proves Roswell Was True" (Hardly!)

Aztec UFO Conference weekend of March 21-22, 2004 ... Wacky and Wackier!

The Daily Times (Farmington, NM) reported on March 18th, 2004 that "A man, who said there is no Jesus — only alien creators — will speak at the 7th annual Aztec UFO Symposium Saturday. George Green claims religion is 'the biggest problem on the planet,' blinding mankind, so people can no longer think. ...Green said he made contact with the commander from the Pleiadian Star System, who is named Quetzl. It was Quetzl, who gave Green the truth about humanity and its upcoming demise. ... He has two destruction theories. The first he claims is a lowering of the population from six billion to 500 million with only 20 million Americans left by the year 2012. The second is a theory that the ETs will cause a nuclear war which 'would make this another sun.' This is not even a possibility, said nuclear physicist Dave Thomas of Albuquerque. 'Earth is a tiny little planet. It wouldn’t have enough atoms to go nuclear,' said Thomas, who is a former presenter at the symposium. If the Earth could be vaporized, it wouldn’t become a star, but a brown dwarf. This is because its mass would need to be increase by 26,000 to have the bare minimum to make it a star or sun-like object. Nuclear fusion would not be present in the blast, thus a brown dwarf would be created, Thomas said. ..."


Green is a holocaust denier too! The Bakersfield Californian reported on April 11, 2002 that "Commander Gyeorgos Ceres Hatonn is a 9-foot-tall extraterrestrial with serious issues. He distrusts the CIA, the World Bank and Freemasonry, suspects a great 'Jewish-Mafia conspiracy' and believes the government is trying to control the power of the sun and the seismic movement of the earth. ... Cmdr. Hatonn is also an author, with titles such as 'The Trillion Dollar Lie -- The Holocaust' to his credit. Some are still available via Hatonn's anti-Semitic writings are most likely the work of one George Green, who split from the Ekker branch of the Institute in the mid-1990s ... "

Source: (registration)

See Also: Aztec UFO 2004 Site:

NMSR President speaks at AZTEC UFO2001 Conference...

Dave Thomas spoke on Saturday, March 24th , 11 AM - noon, at the UFO 2001, the 4th Annual UFO Symposium in Aztec, New Mexico. Other speakers included Stanton Freidman, Ted Loman, Peter Gersten, Dennis Balthaser, and Peter Davenport.

Aztec UFO 2001 Symposium Report by Dave Thomas

I spoke at the Aztec UFO 2001 Symposium on Saturday, 24 March. I discussed the alleged Aztec "UFO" of 1948, and presented the audience with an image from the October 14th, 1952 edition of the Denver Post that blared the headline "'Saucer Scientist' in $50,000 Fraud," and showed the con-man responsible for the "UFO," Silas Newton, talking with the author of the Aztec UFO book, Frank Scully. I also discussed the Roswell case, and how it was most likely a mis-identified balloon experiment launched from Alamogordo.

UFO author/speaker Stanton Friedman gave his spiel for "Flying Saucers are Real." He is certainly an effective salesman for Roswell. Friedman is extremely good at all the psychological tricks of the trade useful for making one's arguments seem logical and compelling.

Friedman accused skeptics ("noisy negativists") of trying to discredit people (witnesses) instead of tackling the data. YET, in my talk, when I mentioned the testimony of weather officer Irving Newton (regarding how Major Marcel, the central figure of Roswell, tried to convince Newton that the crumpled radar target fragments really did have alien writing, thus demonstrating that the debris was NOT switched-- Marcel himself verified, through Newton, that the balloon/target material was THE Roswell "debris"!), Friedman dismissed this by loudly snickering "Newton lied."

He also referred to ailing skeptic Phil Klass as a "nattering nabob of negativism," borrowing the old line from Spiro Agnew.

It's amazing, really, how Friedman can simultaneously damn the "skeptics" for their awful ad hominem attacks, and then proceed with ad hominems against both the "skeptics" and the "witnesses" he disagrees with. I don't think Stan even sees the dilemma he has created for himself.

Some of my Roswell conclusions are based on an interview the rancher, Brazel, gave to the Roswell paper, printed on 9 July 1947. For example, it is here that Brazel said he first found the "debris" stuff on June 14th, 1947. Friedman and others told me I needed to do my homework - why, "everybody" knows that that Brazel article was written after the goverment "re-programmed" him, and therefore cannot be trusted. (Except the part where Brazel says "It was not a weather balloon" CAN be trusted!?!?!). No, I was wrong to cite that real news story, Friedman said, and instead should rely on [2nd & 3rd-hand] reports that place Brazel's discovery of the debris weeks after June 14th, '47. Our August speaker, Karl Pflock, notes that Brazel wasn't held incommunicadoi by the army, but rather by an over-eager radio station manager, Walt Whitmore, who had Brazel stay overnight at his house so as to obtain the exclusive interview for his radio station, KGFL.

The Farmington Daily Times described the symposium in its 25 March, 2001 edition. Debra Mayeux wrote "While most at the convention wholeheartedly listened to Friedman, there was one man, who doesn't think a case can be made for an Aztec crash or a 1950 flying saucer armada over Farmington. 'I really don't think there's a UFO cover up,' said Dave Thomas, a skeptic from Albuquerque. 'I don't buy this argument that the government is afraid that we would freak out.' Thomas says that if there are UFOs, there sure hasn't been any evidence of their existence. 'After 50 years of this stuff a UFO has never landed on a skeptic's or anybody else's head,' he said. Thomas' argument against the Aztec crash is a dozen newspaper articles documenting a connection between Scully and Denver oil promoter Silas Newton, who was charged with fraud in the 1950s for trying to sell pieces of a flying saucer. Newton had spun the tale that three saucers had crashed in 1948, and one of those was the Aztec saucer, Thomas said. However, those who believe in UFOs say that Thomas' evidence is nothing. Top secret military documents received through the Freedom of Information Act prove that the Aztec UFO must have been the real thing, they point out. One of these men is Ted Loman, the host of an Arizona television show on UFOs. Loman, who did some investigating of his own, said that Scully's story pans out. The crash was caused by radar, and Loman has documents that prove microwave radar stations existed in this area in 1948. 'The document said the radar was to plot UFO traffic,' he said. 'And it eludes to the fact that the radar systems were knocking them down.' Loman says the microwaves were set up in a triangle, and put there to protect places such as Kirtland Air Force Base and Sandia National Labs. This directly correlates with a theory from Friedman that military testing caused the Roswell crash. There were different types of tests going on in southeastern New Mexico: nuclear weapons, V-2 rockets and radar signals. These things brought the aliens here, he said. They wanted to see what we were doing. Loman believes the saucer got caught in the radar beams and dragged down."

AztecUFO2000 Report

by Dave Thomas

I was one of five speakers at the Aztec UFO Symposium on Friday and Saturday, March 24-25, 2000.

Peter Gersten of Citizens Against UFO Secrecy spoke on his Freedom of Information lawsuit against various agencies for information on "football field-sized triangular aerial object that has been seen by thousands of witnesses for the past twenty years." While the judge, Stephen M. McNamee, took it more seriously than most, since the symposium the case has been dismissed. The judge determined that the agencies involved indeed had mad a good-faith effort to locate the requested information.

Ted Loman of Arizona TV fame talked about Roswell as a "Trojan Horse," apparently because the technology we were given at Roswell must be used well, lest it turn against us.

Dennis Balthaser of Roswell talked about underground bases, which may house scores of little green aliens.

Linda Moulton Howe of Philadelphia, a frequent Art Bell guest, at least mentioned Aztec briefly, but spent most of her two hours discussing analyses of "Art's Parts,"strange bits of bismuth and magnesium sent anonymously to Art Bell by a man who claimed his grandpa picked them up from the real Roswell crash. But I don't see why Linda was excited about the strange properties of this metal. After all, the anonymous sender himself explained to Linda Howe why the material should be expected to look TERRESTRIAL, and also why aliens who can zip through light-years of cosmic rays can be brought down by a little radar impulse. He writes "Firstly, I note that the intent of your own efforts as to the exams of the 'artifacts' is to confirm some sort of other-world extraterrestial, source of the metals. This was the initial aspect of the original exams. But, what came to light was that the metal was virtually indiscernable to Earth metals. According to Grandad's notations: 'this was to insure that in the event of crash or capture, that no verification as to the alien network or the homeworld confederation could be proven, and a compromise of the Alien directives transpired.' Apparantly [sic], 'the probeships were constructed with metallic base metals, indistinguishable from Terran metals, as a protective measure & security safeguard.' There was a drawback to this, 'a negative consequence was that the probeships would be vulnerable to radar interferance [sic]. The Aliens remedy to this was to insure the probeships maintained high velocity trajectories, and activated these velocities upon entering the Terran atmosphere.' "

There were many surprises during the day, such as when Linda Moulton Howe declared that she still held significant confidence in the film of alien ship "debris" that accompanied Ray Santilli's completely-discredited "Alien Autopsy" film. You may recall that even FOX TV, which originally aired the film "for the public to decide," finally admitted the film was a hoax -- but perhaps Linda was too busy taping for Art Bell that night.

I was the only one who actually discussed the alleged crash at Aztec, New Mexico in any detail. Read on for an explanation of the Aztec UFO; it wasn't little Venusians in a 99.99-foot-wide saucer, but rather a scheme hatched to line the pockets of a couple of greedy con-artists. Or at least that's what a lot of actual news clippings and interviews indicate.

by Dave Thomas From NMSR Reports, Vol. 4, No. 6, June 1998

The Aztec UFO Symposium

by Dave Thomas

When the Aztec, NM public librarian, Leanne Hathcock, read about Aztec's own crashed saucer story from the late 40s, she decided to organize a symposium to mark the (alleged) 50th anniversary of the event, which supposedly took place in May of 1948. When I learned about this, I dug into the Aztec story, and what I found was amazing. Phil Klass supplied me with a copy of pro-Roswell writer William Moore's devastating 1985 analysis of the Aztec tall tale. I found more revealing information in Curtis Peebles' book Watch the Skies, and in the Air Force's 1997 Roswell report, Case Closed.

I called the librarian, and got myself accepted as a symposium speaker. My wife Pam and I drove up to Aztec on Memorial Day. Once there, I explained the source of the legend of crashed saucers and bodies. It turns out that two grifters, one Silas M. Newton, and one Leo A. GeBauer, met while fleecing the same Denver millionaire. GeBauer liked to sell his cons with devices like the "doodlebug," a secret magnetic device that could supposedly locate oil or gold. Newton was known to pump oil into a well by night, so that he could impress potential investors by pumping it out the next day. Newton and GeBauer were driving through the Mojave desert in August of 1949 when they heard a report of a crashed "alien saucer." And then and there, they hatched the mother of all cons.

GeBauer would pose as the mysterious and powerful government Ph.D. scientist "Dr. Gee." In actuality, he maintained shop equipment at a plant in Arizona. And Newton would tell investors of the recent crash of an alien ship, the analysis by top-secret government labs, and the discovery of magnetic devices that could find oil and gold. Then came the pitch. Newton told the investors that he could get them access to this incredible "alien" technology...for a price. Of course, the alien gadgets were really just GeBauer's magnetic doodlebugs. Newton even talked Hollywood reporter Frank X. Scully into writing a book about the "Aztec crash." Scully trusted Newton completely, and -- without a shred of evidence -- proceeded to write a book that, in fact, only served to give two con men some undeserved credibility. But San Francisco Chronicle reporter J. P. Cahn caught on to the sting. While talking to Newton, Cahn boldly managed to switch a small piece of the "alien ship" with another piece of metal, and promptly had the "alien" material tested. It turned out to be earthly -- the grade of aluminum used for pots and pans.

After Cahn's story was printed in True magazine in 1952, several swindle victims wrote to tell their stories of Newton and GeBauer. Most of these victims couldn't press charges because of statutes of limitations -- most, but not all. The aforementioned Denver millionaire, Herman Flader, had a solid case. The FBI arrested Newton and GeBauer, and the con men were quickly convicted. One of the high points of the November 1953 trial took place when the swindlers' $18,500 "tuner" was shown to be identical to a local surplus unit costing $3.50. Cahn wrote another True exposé on the Aztec UFO swindlers in 1956.

Silas M. Newton

Leo A. GeBauer - "Dr. Gee"

Even though the Aztec story is more pitiful than the Roswell legend, which at least involves some physical evidence, elements of Aztec still remain in popular UFO culture. On May 31st and June 1st, 1998, on the nationally-syndicated radio programs Dreamland and The Art Bell Show, noted UFO researcher Linda Moulton Howe described a secret FBI memo from March 22nd, 1950, written to J. Edgar Hoover himself. Memo author Guy Hottel, of SAC, described an investigator's report of a flying saucer recovery in New Mexico, with mention of three saucers, three-foot tall bodies, metallic cloth, and bandaged alien bodies. The crash was supposedly due to interference from high-powered radar. But all of these elements (saucers, aliens, cloth and tape, radar site) have been firmly traced to the yarns spun by our two swindlers! William Moore even traced how the story got from Silas Newton to J. Edgar Hoover: Newton told George Koehler (employed at radio station KMYR in Denver), who told Morley Davies, who told Ford dealers Murphy and van Horn, who told auto dealer Fick, who told the editor of the Kansas City Wyandotte Echo. By that time, Koehler had become "Coulter," just like a game of "gossip" (or a game of "pi")! This article was picked up in the news, where it caught the interest of the OSI. The OSI agent passed the story on to Guy Hottel of the FBI, and he gave the 8th-hand story to Hoover.

Aztec has a long way to go before they can catch up to Roswell. Considering the dubious benefits to be derived from crass marketing of aliens...maybe they should quit while they're ahead! At least they got a taste of their possible future with one of my fellow symposium speakers, Dan Salters. Dan rambled on for hours about Earth running out of oxygen in 32 years, the aliens are here to wake us up, and -- it doesn't matter if Aztec or Roswell are "real" - they become real when we believe in them.

What does UFOs.About.Com say about the Aztec UFO?  

Did you know that some UFO believers think that Aztec's "UFO" was Silas Newton's scam? See For Yourself!  

The Skeptic's Dictionary does Aztec!

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